Seven Against Wyl - the arrayed forces

Baelon wrote:

Ser Walton Dulver wrote:Well, Ser Walton is waiting for that charge so long now. Will try to stand his ground against Ser Wyl, I only hope it was right decision- no idea what to expect, that's partially mechanics check on my side xD

A Knight of Quality should know better than to charge a waiting opponent. There are such better options against an unmounted foe, like knockdown, and getting the same damage from your horse not moving as you would for the charge, without the charge penalty.

Being a good warrior is much more about using the right tactics for the right situation than it is just being stronger, tougher, etc.

Well, that's litle late for giving me insight into more advanced mechanics :-) I'm glad to see him dead.

A learning experience IC and OOC that ends in triumph seems a decent outcome! Will review thread when I get home.

It's not over quite yet. I expect Ser Walton to win - PCs have huge advantages over even secondary NCs - but Ser Josef has at least one more chance to do some damage, though with hefty penalties from fatigue and wounds (trying to pull the lance was a mistake).

Theomore Tullison wrote:Then again, the best counter for Walton is to charge the horse, and then the KoQ would be fucked.

Of course, that's considered less than honorable conduct, I believe. On a battlefield, you might get away with that more or less unnoticed. In a one-on-one fight with hundreds watching? Not so much.

[OOC fatigue penalties apply immediately, and the effect lasts until your next turn.
You cannot knockdown a mounted opponent, but you can use the "
Pull a rider from their mount"
action.
It is a greater action though, so you would have to take a 4th fatigue.
Also, you would have to let go of your sword with at least one hand, which may or may not matter much.]

Ser Walton Dulver wrote:[ooc: that's way much more than my basic game knowledge what Baelon just did. Ouch :-) ]

[It's even more fun when you're mounted on a polar bear.

He was not able to remove his weapon, so you are impaled and cannot move, but he cannot attack until he frees the weapon, unless he drops the weapon, of course, which I believe he can do as a free action.

You will take a Wound. You can attack. There is no penalty to attack while knocked down or impaled. He did not use a greater action, so you are not pinned. Standing up does not count as movement, so you can use a lesser action to stand up and still be impaled. I don't know if we use the reach rules. Baelon would know. If we don't, kill him. If we do, kill his horse.

I always kill the horse the first thing anyway, but then, I am not a Knight.]

As Baelon says, you could try to use the lance to pull him from his horse, but that is a greater action and probably not worth it as he would just drop the lance as a free action.

[OOC Standing in full plate takes a greater action, so having attacked already would require a fatigue (as Baelon did in the Docks fight). Alternately, you can attempt to stand as a lesser action with an Agility(Acrobatics) test vs a TN 9, but your AP and fatigue penalties would apply.

Also, just saw that the "
Attacking a steed"
section says in the first sentence that it is dishonorable, so it is codified in the rules that it is.

To Nathan's question, no we are not using the reach rules, but as Walton has already attacked this turn he cannot kill either the knight or the horse.]

Baelon wrote:
Also, just saw that the "
Attacking a steed"
section says in the first sentence that it is dishonorable, so it is codified in the rules that it is.

To Nathan's question, no we are not using the reach rules, but as Walton has already attacked this turn he cannot kill either the knight or the horse.]

And attacking an unmounted man with a lance is 'honourable'? Glad I am not a Knight. You guys have strange rules.

I was presuming that, since Ser Josef had just attacked, it was now Walton's turn. Is that not the case?

Nathaniel Mason wrote:And attacking an unmounted man with a lance is 'honourable'? Glad I am not a Knight. You guys have strange rules.

I was presuming that, since Ser Josef had just attacked, it was now Walton's turn. Is that not the case?

Well, Ser Josef gave Ser Walton the option, and even if his action is deemed dishonorable, it wouldn't change that attacking the horse would be dishonorable. Glad to continue this conversation if you'd like, but maybe in a different thread? This one is starting to get cluttered.

Ser Walton posted an attack this turn [url=in this post][/url].

Well, my best advice, Walton, since you have attacked this turn, is to attempt to stand as a lesser action with an agility check. You have a good agility and you might manage it even with AP and Fatigue. It's only a TN9.

It will at least rob him of the +1D.

Next round he will have to try and remove his lance, or he can't use it. (He could use a greater action to pin you, but that does not prevent attacks under the impale rules either.)

The alternative is he just drops the weapon, pulls a sword and attacks you.

On your next turn, you can attack him, or if circumstances forbid, you can always try to sunder the lance.

Arguably, Walton should have used Reckless attack rather than standard, which would have done the trick. Given the circumstances (relative player inexperience plus Baelon upping the difficulty level higher than reader's usual MO) I'd be inclined to allow that retcon. Failing that, attempting to get back up with agility roll is a good choice.

[ooc: appreciate the enthusiasm, but I'll move all these wicked OOC posts (including mine!) over when I get home: discussion welcom, but please use other threads.

Discussed tactics with Baelon and blessed them via PM. I was clearly working towards this anyway and helped Walton via pm. This IS my usual MO and a sensible tactic against a footman. NPCs don't want to die. Baelon's involvement is mechanical, no impact on difficulty.

Players have destiny and can always surrender and be ransomed if the worst happens. Victories are worth more with some peril and Ser Kevan took a loss nobly.

Enough fun policing until I get home :;
): ]

To aid in preserving OOC player harmony, I am relinquishing control of Ser Josef to Reader.

Well, I finally made it to the new forum and ready to start the battle under the wings of a dragon. That is just awe inspiring somehow

Looking for stories to "back-fill" Aerion into, I was thinking he could fit in as (essentially) a man-at-arms serving in one of the Coalition Cavalry units here in the "Storming" thread (serving the Dragons by attacking Dornishmen is so up his alley it's not even funny). He's not a knight, so he'd be kept from the "Veteran" Coalition Cavalry (maybe at Alayne Tarly's suggestion, as a way to snub Ser Harbert, in a way)...but if an attached PC might be something y'all would be willing to add before too many more dice get rolled, I'd totally be game for him to serve as Previously Never Given A Close-Up Cavalry Fighter #37.

Can always use more manpower. But Veteran cavalry are not likely all knights, I think.

Though as it happens, Alayne is the sub-commander on our side with the highest status, so should Theo be incapacitated, he'd take over, thus being second in command, technically anyway. Which might make him assign you to one of the trained cavalry units without Theo making much of it, incidentally, we plan on sending those into the line of fire, so maybe he anticipates that you'll get routed alongside with those men?

In my head, I picture him fitting in equipment-wise with a regular "trained" cav unit, moreso than the "veteran" ones (especially since, IIRC, the veteran ones specifically had gear upgrades). His starting PC kit isn't full plate and a destrier and the like, so in the abstraction of military units being lumped together by their equipment, I guess he just feels better in the lesser unit.

His skills themselves are all out of wack for either, mind you.

But I'm fine either way, man. If an extra sword-arm would help out and there's a way to integrate another PC into a unit, I'm game, and I can leave the details to the folks that know the system better.

They're having half-plates, mostly, But sitting on rounseys. Probably some Full Plate here, some Brigandine there, not likely any uniform standard. Plan in general is that trained coalition forces will be charging in first, with the more experienced troops being the reserves. So mostly we're putting sub-commanders with the latter (they may switch to champion if situation demands), champions we placed on our most potent ranged units. Though a third champion would probably indeed best be placed with a trained cavalry unit so as to boost the abilities of such units as manages to make it to the wall with their discipline intact. Might even give you a shot at first over the wall (originally promised to Walton, but him being wounded and injured and stuff...Theo probably not as keen on that). But if you manage that, we'll probably be knighting you on the spot.

Fist over the wall follows my event structure. Will try to post it soon.

Theomore Tullison wrote:They're having half-plates, mostly, But sitting on rounseys. Probably some Full Plate here, some Brigandine there, not likely any uniform standard.

He's in a Breastplate, himself, atop a rounsey. That's why I figure he'd fit in better -- logistically IC, thematically OOC -- with them, than with the ones specifically called out as being veterans, and with equipment upgrades.

Plan in general is that trained coalition forces will be charging in first, with the more experienced troops being the reserves. So mostly we're putting sub-commanders with the latter (they may switch to champion if situation demands), champions we placed on our most potent ranged units. Though a third champion would probably indeed best be placed with a trained cavalry unit so as to boost the abilities of such units as manages to make it to the wall with their discipline intact. Might even give you a shot at first over the wall (originally promised to Walton, but him being wounded and injured and stuff...Theo probably not as keen on that). But if you manage that, we'll probably be knighting you on the spot.

In my head, I picture him as...kind of a "surprise champion," I guess? Like, it's not as though he'd be invited to the command tent (especially not with Tarly there), unless it was to pour the wine or something. So not an official commander or champion or anything, there's no little chess piece of Aerion Storm in particular that anyone put on the map, offering him much of anything. But in the heat of battle, if no one else does the job, his PC-ness rises to the occasion and he kind of emerges from the unit a little, shouting a little louder than everyone else around him, swinging his sword a little harder, riding a little better...and stands out from the herd.

...unless the dice are terrible and he chokes and dies, but, hey, that's the risk of playing a combat character, I guess.

Aerion Storm wrote:In my head, I picture him as...kind of a "surprise champion," I guess?  Like, it's not as though he'd be invited to the command tent (especially not with Tarly there), unless it was to pour the wine or something.  So not an official commander or champion or anything, there's no little chess piece of Aerion Storm in particular that anyone put on the map, offering him much of anything.  But in the heat of battle, if no one else does the job, his PC-ness rises to the occasion and he kind of emerges from the unit a little, shouting a little louder than everyone else around him, swinging his sword a little harder, riding a little better...and stands out from the herd.

Being a leader or a hero isn't about who you are, it's about how others see you. You might go out there as just another soldier, but as soon as the rest of the troop starts seeing you as inspiring... job's done.

Aerion Storm wrote:...unless the dice are terrible and he chokes and dies, but, hey, that's the risk of playing a combat character, I guess.  

That's what DP are for. I highly recommend always leaving at least one unspent: that way if you take a scorpion bolt to the face, you can burn the DP and survive.

Sounds like him just signing up for the campaign, ending up in that cavalry unit and boosting it's capabilities by being badass? Mechanically represented as champion.

And then possibly emerging as not just some horseman anymore.

Theomore Tullison wrote:Sounds like him just signing up for the campaign, ending up in that cavalry unit and boosting it's capabilities by being badass? Mechanically represented as champion.

Yeah, that's what I figured. He's there because maybe Ser Harbert couldn't be (an injury?) or just didn't want to be (not sharing a field with Tarly), but still wanted to be sure to contribute to the coalition forces...but he's just there, not yet noteworthy, militarily. Just riding among the cavalry, another (basically) man-at-arms...until the dice start flying, and he hopefully distinguishes himself.

One of the people on the front doing very well at staying alive and kicking ass. Fighters nearby take notice and get a small boost to morale, which causing a domino effect with diminishing returns. Sounds cool to me. Maybe there's like one or two people among them who may recognize your face or your livery as a Stormlander and connect you to your sponsor before the fight begins? "Oi, ya see that one there? That's Ser Harbert's squire!" "No...a Stormlander an' a Baratheon?" "Well-trained too, by the look of 'im!"

Aerion Storm wrote:

Theomore Tullison wrote:Sounds like him just signing up for the campaign, ending up in that cavalry unit and boosting it's capabilities by being badass? Mechanically represented as champion.

Yeah, that's what I figured.  He's there because maybe Ser Harbert couldn't be (an injury?) or just didn't want to be (not sharing a field with Tarly), but still wanted to be sure to contribute to the coalition forces...but he's just there, not yet noteworthy, militarily.  Just riding among the cavalry, another (basically) man-at-arms...until the dice start flying, and he hopefully distinguishes himself.  

Ser Harbert is quite definitely there because he won't share the battlefield with a Tarly. Ser Alayne Tarly specifically.

Agree on how you guys have pitched the "champion" slot, with Loreia's point following as people link Aerion Storm to Ser Harbert, as the bastard hopefully puts on an impressive display!

I suppose it would be agreeable if they were on opposite sides